Talk:de
Latin
Dē in latin means down from, and de, if it exists, is exactly the same as the genitive case's second function... could someone fix this? Wikisquared 20:24, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
Swedish pronunciation
I don't really know how to write IPA correctly, but the present does not seem correct to me. Sure, in informal speech it often ends with an i: sound (also in Sweden, don't really know about Finland), but just as often I think that the original ˈdɔm looks better (hey, that's where the informal spelling dom comes from!). Then there is the more articulated (formal) version which ends in (som kind of) e sound, more like how it's spelled. Could someone who knows about Swedish and IPA try to correct this, please? \Mike 03:45, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
- I added the formal pronunciation , since the long Swedish e-vowel is the IPA . I don't think you could say that is a pronunciation of de, and one could also ask if not too should be regarded as a manifestation of a separate form: di.
85.231.217.248 21:41, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
- As far as I know many speakers use when they read the word de out loud. So it is indeed a pronunciation of it. (Unless I'm mistaken.)
- Virtually all dialects of Swedish pronounce de as , especially the major regional standards. Finland Swedish is a notable exception. When "de" is read aloud, it often becomes , but that can also be seen as hyper-correct "reading pronunciation" (läsuttal). Overall, is the pronunciation in virtually all contexts. Anyone who isn't actually reading directly from a text in front of them is unlikely to ever say .
- Many of the most common words tend to have highly variable pronunciations that often poorly match spelling, like mig/dig (mej/dej) och (ock, short å) att (short å), är (long e or ä), etc.
- Peter Isotalo 13:24, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
Spanish
if de follows a word ending in a vowel, doesn't /de/ become /ðe/?
- Not only de, but d generally, and not only after a vowel, but after most consonants. The letter d is pronounced as English /d/ at the beginning of an initial word or after l or n. Otherwise, it’s soft like /ð/. At the end of a word, it can be so soft that it may virtually disappear. —Stephen 16:16, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
Dutch
What does de mean in "Ik mocht mn ex-man de auto lenen" which is a perfectly valid sentence. I just don't know how to put this in English. 81.68.255.36 20:51, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
- de means the: I let my ex-husband borrow the car. —Stephen 21:02, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
RFD
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rfd-sense: Translingual, "Germany". Should be uppercase DE I think. -- Liliana • 13:55, 12 July 2011 (UTC)
- Lowercase "de" stands for German (the language). Just correct the entry. —Angr 17:21, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
- But language codes don't meet CFI, see Talk:jv. -- Liliana • 17:29, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
- What about Internet domains? Or is the period considered part of the domain, so it should be .de? —Angr 06:52, 16 July 2011 (UTC)
- I think you just answered the question yourself, just check .de... -- Liliana • 02:13, 17 July 2011 (UTC)
- What about Internet domains? Or is the period considered part of the domain, so it should be .de? —Angr 06:52, 16 July 2011 (UTC)
- But language codes don't meet CFI, see Talk:jv. -- Liliana • 17:29, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
- It's unlikely but possible that this is attested. Consider these cites, which use "de" and "DE" to mean "German":
- 2000, January 20, "Andreas Prilop" (username), "Language selection / content negotiation problems", in comp.infosystems.www.servers.misc, Usenet:
- Do you have any *realistic* example where such a pedantic distinction should be necessary? Not even books in the "real world" are translated between US English and UK English . I have always wondered what is meant by "Accept-Language: de-AT,en" in an e-mail message, for example. I don't speak de-AT - so I must answer in English??
- 2000 August 14, "Rafael Adam Wugalter" (username), "Quick EN-DE favour for translator who doesn't speak DE", in sci.lang.translation, Usenet
- 2002 May 14, "The Oik" (username), "Letter from an English lady (was what did Europe look like in 1944-45)", rec.travel.europe, Usenet:
- Oh, pleeease! They assumed you were an American with investment funds to held rebuild a country abandonned because the West was too concerned with its oil supply (and foolish to boot). When you spoke DE, they assumed you from over the border, and knew enough not to get ripped off (you do *know* they speak German two hours up the road?).
- -sche (discuss) 04:00, 1 April 2012 (UTC)
- Kept as no consensus. — Ungoliant (Falai) 16:54, 12 August 2012 (UTC)
RFV
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still not cited with the capitalization given -- Liliana • 19:02, 12 August 2012 (UTC)
- I assume you mean the translingual sense? —CodeCat 20:11, 12 August 2012 (UTC)
- Yes, yes. -- Liliana • 20:14, 12 August 2012 (UTC)
- Removed (converted to a see-also link). - -sche (discuss) 00:37, 15 October 2012 (UTC)
RFC discussion: November 2007–December 2010
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Latin section needs a lot of cleanup. I'm through following BiT around with a shovel. --EncycloPetey 23:51, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
- It's extensive, but it looks alright. ? — Beobach 01:28, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
Low German
dei: Some authors used dei as article and maybe also as pronoun. Example: Allgemeines plattdeutsches Volksbuch. Sammlung von Dichtungen, Sagen, Märchen, Schwänken, Volks- und Kinderreimen, Sprichwörtern, Räthseln usw. (H. F. W. Raabe (editor), Wismar and Ludwigslust, 1854). Fritz Reuter used dei in earlier works (Kein Hüsung, 1858), but changed it to de (Kein Hüsung, 6th edition, 1872).
dee: Some authors use dee for the pronoun. Maybe some authors also used it for the article, but I'm not aware of that.
Karl Nerger (Grammatik des meklenburgischen Dialektes älterer und neuerer Zeit. Laut- und Flexionslehre, Leipzig, 1869) makes the difference that de is the article, while dê, dei is the pronoun. However, his spellings are uncommon, and this might be an artificial difference or some Low German dialects might miss this difference or some Low German authors might not be aware of this difference. In the grammatical notes in Plattdeutsche Dichtungen in meklenburger Mundart von Friedrich und Karl Eggers. Herausgegeben mit sprachlichen Erläuterungen und vollständigem Wörterbuche von Dr. Karl Nerger (Breslau, 1875) the pronoun is spelled both dee and de, while the article is spelled de. In the dictionary, dee and de are distinguished: "de, best. Art., m., f., pl., der, die; als hochtoniges Demonstrativ, zu sprechen dee, wie deshalb auch oft in den Text gesetzt ist." and "dee, aus de durch Hochton entstanden, pron. dem., dieser, der da, derjenige. Ostmeklenburgisch dei." -Sperans y (talk) 19:37, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
Lua: not enough memory
Is there any protocol for splitting this page in two, to solve the problem of there being too many templates in use on a single page? --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 23:30, 9 July 2021 (UTC)
Spanish 'e
Vamo' a sacar a tu novio 'e la ecuación --Backinstadiums (talk) 14:01, 22 October 2021 (UTC)
Tagalog Entry?
@Ysrael214 Could you explain the reason for you adding this entry? My thoughts on this are the following:
- The word "de" has never been used in Tagalog throughout its history as an equivalent of the word ng or ni. In other words, we're not free to say something like "gamot de doktor" instead of "gamot ng doktor".
- So far, the presence of "de" is limited to surnames of Spanish origin (such as "de Dios" or "de Leon"), place names (such as "Cagayan de Oro" or "Davao de Oro"), and phrases directly borrowed from Spanish like "Miyerkoles de Senisa", "kabesa de barangay", "dama de noche", "Flores de Mayo", "kaha de yero", "kadena de amor", "keso de bola", "keso de plato", "kargo-de-konsiyensiya", "konsuwelo de bobo", "papel de liha", "piyano de-kola", "pe de bawtismo", "papel de ahensiya", "menor de edad", or "brazo de Mercedes". Maybe some are locally derived like "miting de avance", "petsa de peligro", or "pan de regla".
- Actually, after further thought, perhaps this can be a Tagalog entry, but only limited to deriving expressions, mostly Spanish sounding. It's never freely used in sentences, and it never was.
Yeah, I made this conclusion as I was typing this, so you can add your thoughts if you want to. Thanks. Mar vin kaiser (talk) 13:50, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Mar vin kaiser Only for derived expressions that isn't "de-" meaning "made of" Ysrael214 (talk) 14:56, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Mar vin kaiser I mean I literally put it there: "now only found in derived terms" similarly to the obsolete roots. Ysrael214 (talk) 14:57, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Ysrael214: Yeah, I saw that, but when I read "now", it kinda implied that before it was used elsewhere. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 15:06, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Ysrael214: I'm seeing if we can compare this to English words of French origin that has the word "de", like "cul-de-sac" or "tour de force", but there's no entry for "de" like this in English. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 15:07, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Mar vin kaiser English has Latin cum (“with”) and that isn't even used heavily in English. Also Cebuano de exists. Ysrael214 (talk) 20:09, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Ysrael214: For English cum from Latin, it gives quotations and attestation, and although it's not heavily used, it is used as a free word. Meanwhile, the usage of "de" is not free, you can't construct a sentence and put just any word after the word "de". In Tagalog, "de" always comes within a Spanish phrase, although we do use the word "de" to derive new expressions, like "petsa de peligro", which to me seems like an expression popularized recently, not sure though. The Cebuano entry seems to also face the same issues as the Tagalog one. For me, the question is, if "de" here acts like a fossilized word in expressions of Spanish origin (though there exists new derivations I think), does it meet attestation criteria. I'm still checking and thinking about it though. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 05:17, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Mar vin kaiser English has Latin cum (“with”) and that isn't even used heavily in English. Also Cebuano de exists. Ysrael214 (talk) 20:09, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Ysrael214: I'm seeing if we can compare this to English words of French origin that has the word "de", like "cul-de-sac" or "tour de force", but there's no entry for "de" like this in English. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 15:07, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Ysrael214: Yeah, I saw that, but when I read "now", it kinda implied that before it was used elsewhere. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 15:06, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
- @Mar vin kaiser I mean I literally put it there: "now only found in derived terms" similarly to the obsolete roots. Ysrael214 (talk) 14:57, 1 January 2023 (UTC)