Talk:kiss someone's ring
RFC discussion: May 2017
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Should these be moved to "kiss one's ring", etc.? — SMUconlaw (talk) 07:45, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
- Hm, I think they're good where they are. I think we (and other English dictionaries that I've seen) use "one" when the person in the slot is usually the actor of the verb / phrase / etc, and "someone" when the person is usually someone else. And it's usually "I kissed her ring" rather than "I kissed my ring", so the title seems fine. - -sche (discuss) 08:08, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
- OK, I was wondering if we had a policy on this. — SMUconlaw (talk) 08:23, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
- I don't know if we do, but I wish we did. It's a good rule of thumb to use "one's" when the slot is usually filled by the subject of the verb, and "someone's" when the slot is usually filled by someone other than the subject of the verb. Another test is to see if you want to add own when the "(some)one's" refers to the subject; if it sounds better with the own, then the phrase is usually not reflexive. For example, you're more likely to say "I'm getting on my own nerves" than "I'm getting on my nerves", so the phrase usually isn't reflexive, so the entry should be get on someone's nerves, not *get on one's nerves. Likewise if you wanted to say (under some bizarre set of circumstances) that someone is acting sycophantic toward himself, you could say "He's kissing his own ass", because kiss someone's ass isn't usually reflexive. But kiss one's ass goodbye usually is reflexive, because you would more likely say "He's kissing his ass goodbye" without the own. Does that make any sense? —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 09:43, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
- Hmmm, I suppose so. We really should document this somewhere. Which policy could this be incorporated into? — SMUconlaw (talk) 13:04, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
- It's documented in WT:About English#Phrases, in a paragraph which I just expanded slightly to make it a bit clearer. (Please continue to improve the wording if necessary.) - -sche (discuss) 17:50, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
- Hmmm, I suppose so. We really should document this somewhere. Which policy could this be incorporated into? — SMUconlaw (talk) 13:04, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
- I don't know if we do, but I wish we did. It's a good rule of thumb to use "one's" when the slot is usually filled by the subject of the verb, and "someone's" when the slot is usually filled by someone other than the subject of the verb. Another test is to see if you want to add own when the "(some)one's" refers to the subject; if it sounds better with the own, then the phrase is usually not reflexive. For example, you're more likely to say "I'm getting on my own nerves" than "I'm getting on my nerves", so the phrase usually isn't reflexive, so the entry should be get on someone's nerves, not *get on one's nerves. Likewise if you wanted to say (under some bizarre set of circumstances) that someone is acting sycophantic toward himself, you could say "He's kissing his own ass", because kiss someone's ass isn't usually reflexive. But kiss one's ass goodbye usually is reflexive, because you would more likely say "He's kissing his ass goodbye" without the own. Does that make any sense? —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 09:43, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
- OK, I was wondering if we had a policy on this. — SMUconlaw (talk) 08:23, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
Word of the day 17/12/18
I'm wondering if choosing this as the word of the day in honour of Pope Francis's birthday is a poor taste joke? Here in Ireland, to kiss someone's ring is to kiss their ass in a derogatory manner. Like you tell someone to kiss your ring when you want them to go away, or you'd rather kiss someone's ring if you really don't want to do something, implying you'd sooner perform analingus on them than do the thing. Compare kiss my hoop, or ask my hoop. Considering the place of the church in Ireland historically and today, is this supposed to be a really really poor taste joke, or did whoever chose the WOTD only look at meanings in one country? 89.19.67.97 12:46, 17 December 2018 (UTC)
- Perhaps that is the connotation which the term has in Ireland (and I wouldn't know as I'm not from there), but as the definition indicates it also has a neutral sense of giving respect or reverence to someone. — SGconlaw (talk) 14:55, 17 December 2018 (UTC)
- If that's the connotation it has in Ireland, it's probably worth including in the entry. Andrew Sheedy (talk) 23:52, 17 December 2018 (UTC)
- Let’s see the quotations first. — SGconlaw (talk) 01:57, 18 December 2018 (UTC)
- If that's the connotation it has in Ireland, it's probably worth including in the entry. Andrew Sheedy (talk) 23:52, 17 December 2018 (UTC)
- rofl Per utramque cavernam 00:31, 18 December 2018 (UTC)