Wiktionary:Information desk/2025/January

I am requesting that Module:ja-pron be editable. Shlyst (talk) 20:02, 4 January 2025 (UTC)

Two pages have been contradictory to each other on whether 畫 or 畵 is the variant form in Korean. In 畫, what can be seen is this

template on the right, showing that 畵 is the preferred form in Korean, yet in the Korean entry, 畫 was defined as "hanja form^? of 화 (“picture; drawing; painting”) ". However, in 畵, this was defined as "Alternative form of 畫 (“hanja form^? of 화 (“picture; drawing; painting”)”)". Can someone clarify for me please? 2601:182:501:6780:D82E:41F9:4A09:AC6E 04:30, 6 January 2025 (UTC)

Starting today, there were no entries in "derived terms" instead it says: Anhhocviet (talk) 15:00, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

Can you give a link to an example entry? —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 15:13, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

Hì Justin, thx for responding:) I encountered the error at the Vietnamese entry for "cách" https://en.wiktionary.orghttps://dictious.com/en/c%C3%A1ch but it somehow doesn't show now... Did you resolve it?,😊 Chris Anhhocviet (talk) 19:29, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

I did nothing, but I'll take the credit. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 19:51, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

Hi, the wiktionary eng link to "Corniculate" is missing its etymology. Does anyone know it? I suppose it is probably Latin or Ancient Greek, like most anatomical terms (context: Corniculate cartilage) Petros Poupis (talk) 20:49, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

I added it. You want to go to the Etymology Scriptorium for such queries btw. Saumache (talk) 21:23, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

Ah thank you! Sorry, I'm new to the platform 😅 - duly noted! 80.94.121.124 21:42, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

In a weird anglicized construction, Nycteris can mean 'Disorder in the Night' and was used in that context by CS Lewis in The Pilgrims Regress on pp 83 and 88. Tony Greyhound (talk) 16:07, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

Maybe not a newbie question, but how am I supposed to look for colons (:) in Sanskrit quotations? Those should be changed to visarga, but with the accent (either U0952 ॒ or U0951 ॑) after it. An example here. Exarchus (talk) 19:02, 14 January 2025 (UTC)

You can search with regex; paste this into your search bar:

incategory:"Sanskrit terms with quotations" insource:/:/ Vuccala (talk) 03:18, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

Thank you! Exarchus (talk) 09:56, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

Hello all! For context, My French is below grade school level. I came across the phrase "fr:qu’est-ce que c’est que ça que c’est", and was only able to find the translation on French Wiktionary, not here. I am attempting to translate the french entry so that we can have an entry here too. Here is my attempt: User:Gallium314/Sandbox/qu’est-ce que c’est que c’est que ça

Is translating from other Wiktionaries frowned upon? I am relying heavily on machine translation to translate the French definition. I am not using machine translation to generate a definition.

My second question is if my attempt is suitable or missing anything obvious. This is my first ever page, so I don't know much about form and am trying to follow the example of the entry for qu'est-ce que c'est. Thank you for the help! Gallium314 (talk) 05:10, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

Looks like a decent attempt. I have some observations:

• We use apostrophe ' (U+0027) rather than right quotation mark ’ (U+2019) when spelling French terms. French Wiktionary, however, uses the latter. Interwiki links between the two are created automatically and handle the difference.
• You are right not to directly publish a machine-generated translation that hasn't been vetted by a knowledgeable human. It's fine to use other Wiktionaries to guide one's research but they aren't a direct source.
• Given that your draft definition explains how/why the term is used (as opposed to glossing the term's meaning directly with an English translation), it should be enclosed in the {{non-gloss}} template, which will italicize it.
• We don't have a 'Variants' heading (see Wiktionary:Entry layout for the headings we use).
• A creator of a new entry should be satisfied that the term meets the criteria for inclusion. See in particular the section about attestation. Terms that have scant attestation of real-world usage online or in durably-archived media may be challenged at some point. I'm not saying that this one will be, or prejudging the outcome if it is, just bringing this to your attention as you are a new editor.

Voltaigne (talk) 02:03, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

I am talking about the label used to mark words here, not the everyday definition.

It is currently defined in Appendix:Glossary as "Language that is intended or likely to cause offense" (my bolding). However, several editors, most notably @Zacwill, keep removing them from various words because they are "not offensive", even though they are verifiably likely to cause offence, at least in some cases. They are absolutely right in that they are not intended to cause offence, but they are nevertheless likely to in some cases. I can only assume they think that the label is only applicable to the former (intended to cause offence), not the latter (likely to cause offence). If this is the case, then we should remove the "or likely" from the definition, or at least change the "or" to and "and". People have been banned from social media for using the "f-words" (I even got into a spot of bother on Wikipedia for it; they basically said it's offensive to Americans regardless of how it's used) in their "non-offensive" senses. Yes, I know that in some cases, the bans were lifted, but this is not always the case, and it still speaks volumes about how the words are seen, rightly or wrongly.

Now, I am in no way endorsing them being seen as offensive, merely documenting. It seems to me that a significant number of people see these words as offensive (rightly or wrongly), and they certainly seem to fit the heading "offensive" as currently defined, so this needs clarification. Adam9007 (talk) 07:38, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

For context, the words in question are fag (in the senses "cigarette", "chore", etc.), faggot (in the sense "meatball"), and snigger. I do not think labelling them "offensive" is helpful. We already have usage notes explaining that Americans are likely to avoid them because of their similarity to slurs. Zacwill (talk) 07:56, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

Americans avoiding them is one thing, but treating them (again, rightly or wrongly) as offensive when others use them is another. Adam9007 (talk) 07:59, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

Agreed (Zac). You can for example buy meat products labelled as "faggots" in the UK. Shops do not hide these or refuse to stock them. Adam, please don't duplicate the LONG Wikipedia thread you linked above, here. 2A00:23C5:FE1C:3701:2921:96CC:86C1:8A99 08:01, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

Why would a UK shop censor the word "faggot"? I'm talking about situations where Americans are likely to see legitimate usages of the word like this, e.g. on social media. They are likely to see it as offensive, possibly even if they know what it means, as happened to me on Wikipedia. Adam9007 (talk) 08:07, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

This reply doesn't make sense. I guess it must have been made assuming Adam9007 came here with some intention to nitpick about words.

About what Adam9007 actually came to discuss: indeed, I wouldn’t find it productive to add “offensive” tags to such senses. I’ve never seen this either. Unless someone thinks this is actually common practice, I think we should change the glossary definition. Polomo47 (talk) 14:17, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

Yeah, this isn't the first time people have assumed I want to play word games or something like that. But, this doesn't alter the fact that the way I read the 'offensive' label as it's currently defined, I'm seeing no suggestion that is it only meant for slurs. Yet, several people seem to think that it is. The way I'm reading it, the label can be applied to anything that might well cause offence, regardless of why. By the logic these editors are using, 'England' to mean the United Kingdom shouldn't be labelled as offensive, as it's not intended to cause offence nor does it refer to a person or group of people, or a characteristic thereof, which seem to be the de facto criteria for being eligible for the 'offensive' label. But the label as it's currently defined just means that it can cause offence, which does not necessarily mean that it is a slur. This is what needs to be clarified. Adam9007 (talk) 02:34, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

I have three requests:

• The UK IPA spelling on pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis is incorrect. Whereas currently it is /njuːˌmɒ-/ it should be /ˌnjuːmə-/, as per the OED and the accompanying Wikipedia article.
• I have uploaded an audio file at that has the correct pronunciation (I have tried to make it as clear as possible but it is obviously quite difficult!). I would appreciate if someone would add this with a British English or RP accent
• The US pronunciation audio has many mispronunciations and should be removed entirely to not mislead readers.

As the page is locked I cannot fix this. If someone else can I would appreciate it greatly; thank you! Soundguys (talk) 14:31, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

@Soundguys thanks for your contribution. Our entry referenced the OED's second edition, which doesn't offer IPA of the word but presents it as follows: "pneuˌmonoultramicroˈscopicˌsilicovolcanoconiˈosis". I can see that this has been changed in OED3, so I updated the entry and added your audio (thanks!). This, that and the other (talk) 04:29, 24 January 2025 (UTC)

There is no FWOTD for today or any day in the near future. I would like to help but I am not aware of how to convert nominations or my own ideas into accepted FWOTDs. Anyone could help out educate me? @Sgconlaw I remember you regularly helped out with word of the day. Thanks anyone for helping. Garethphua (言) 02:51, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

@Garethphua: I’m afraid I don’t work on the FWOTD at all. At the moment they’re set by @Lingo Bingo Dingo, who’s probably a bit busy these days. — Sgconlaw (talk) 05:00, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

I'm also available to help with FWOTD. I've also noticed the delayed entries for a good few weeks now — tried submitting a word once, but indeed the pages are (secretly) locked. Polomo47 (talk) 17:59, 24 January 2025 (UTC)

I would like for it to be replaced by my Meta-Wiki user page at https://meta.wikimedia.orghttps://dictious.com/en/User:Iritscen. I believe that will be copied in here automatically if the content at the local page User:Iritscen is removed, right? --Iritscen (talk) 22:41, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

 Done — SURJECTION ^{/ T / C / L /} 07:09, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

Is there an up to date 'Wiktionary lookup' extension, that works reliably in Firefox? I tried to look up the word "Alas" in English, and received a result for Estonian. Ineuw (talk) 05:51, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

Wiktionary is case-sensitive so things like Alas and alas will have different entries. Did you try doing it with a lowercase a? 115.188.138.105 09:56, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

I was wondering if there is a better way to handle the possibilities, rather than me changing the case. It was the start of a paragraph.Ineuw (talk) 21:59, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

In per se#Latin, I added the templates Template:R:du Cange and Template:R:LOGEION, but couldn't make them handle the space from the pagename. The first splits the pagename weirdly between the parameters, the second replaces a space with a '+'. How to fix this? Danny lost (talk) 20:19, 24 January 2025 (UTC)

Got it via mw:Help:Magic_words#URL_data. Danny lost (talk) 22:51, 24 January 2025 (UTC)

In 나, there's a reference which its title is written {{lang|ko|{{ruby|(모)(음)의 (의)(미)(교)(체)의 (범)(주)-(중)(기)(국)(어)를 (중)(심)으로}}}} which includes a hyphen in the book name. But in the actual display 母(모)音(음)의 意(의)味(미)交(교)替(체)의 範(범)疇(주)中(중)期(기)國(국)語(어)를 中(중)心(심)으로 the hyphen disappeared. What should I do? 列维劳德 (talk) 00:40, 25 January 2025 (UTC)

We have no children. However, we have 35 nieces & nephews and their children = many more grand niece's and grand nephews. So, to seperate - me as an Uncle - or Grand Uncle from their Grandparents the kids came up with a new name - which I believe should be added to Wikipedia... GRUMPLE = Not an Uncle

See WT:CFI for which words are able to be added. Vininn126 (talk) 19:22, 31 January 2025 (UTC)

Thank you. Will follow up. RichardMSSFD541 (talk) 21:52, 31 January 2025 (UTC)