User talk:Carl Francis/Archive 1

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Welcome

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Enjoy your stay at Wiktionary! Chuck Entz (talk) 18:32, 11 September 2015 (UTC)Reply

A few problems with your etymologies

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hi, I have had to fix up many of the etymologies you provided, so I want to let you know.

  • {{etyl|ceb|ceb}} should only be used for twice-borrowed terms: when a term was borrowed from Cebuano into another language, and then Cebuano borrowed that term back again.
  • {{term}} should always have the lang= parameter. Or better still, use {{m}}, as {{term}} is a bit obsolete.
  • Sanskrit terms should be given in Devanagari script. If you don't know how to write it, give the transliteration with tr=.

Thank you. —CodeCat 17:17, 4 October 2015 (UTC)Reply

# in synonyms

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hi Carl. We use bullet lists (with *) instead of numeric lists (with #) in sections other than the one with the definitions. If you need to link to a specific sense, you can use the template {{sense}}. — Ungoliant (falai) 18:31, 5 November 2015 (UTC)Reply

Edit summaries

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hi. When creating a new page, could you leave the edit summary box blank? This allows us to see the actual page contents in Recent Changes. Thanks! Equinox ◑ 08:05, 29 November 2015 (UTC)Reply

Babel

Latest comment: 9 years ago2 comments2 people in discussion

Carl, you need to add a babel box to your userpage at Carl Francis. Here is an example, but you need to adjust it so that it reflects your language ability. Please let me know if you need any help with it. —Stephen (Talk) 22:38, 4 January 2016 (UTC) Reply

Wiktionary:Babel
enThis user is a native speaker of English.
ceb-4Kining maong gumagamit makatampo og daw-lumad nga matang sa Sinugboanon.
tl-1Payak ang kaalaman ng tagagamit na ito sa Tagalog.
Search user languages or scripts
Also, we don't treat Filipino as a separate language from Tagalog, but the Babel system doesn't know that. WT:LOL has our list of languages and language codes that we consider valid, and WT:LANGTREAT has explanations for many of the languages we don't recognize. I know you know that, but I didn't want us to make it any more confusing for Carl than it already is by giving unintentionally misleading examples. Chuck Entz (talk) 02:09, 5 January 2016 (UTC)Reply

Nested suffixes

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hi. In the entry sinugdanan, you typed:

{{infix|ceb|{{suffix|ceb|{{suffix|ceb|sugod|an}}|an}}|in}}

I replaced it by:

{{infix|ceb|sugod|-in-}} + {{af|ceb|-an|-an}}

My point is, I think it's better not to nest suffix templates repeatedly. The template {{af}} (or {{affix}}) recognizes suffixes and prefixes automatically by the placement of the hyphen. Unfortunately, {{af}} does not support infixes, that's why I kept the {{infix}} separately. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 05:28, 29 June 2016 (UTC)Reply

taga

Latest comment: 8 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Why did you revert my bot? DTLHS (talk) 23:39, 7 March 2017 (UTC)Reply

Regarding those you call "useless" categories

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

As you said on my talk page, I am adding "useless categories". But no, one category you removed on one entry I edited is related to basic words, or words being taught to a learner of a language. If you now know what those "basic words" mean, such as in Category:Cebuano basic words, then you may provide me a list of words considered basic (or taught to a learner), so I can categorize them under it. TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 05:00, 26 August 2017 (UTC)Reply

Cebuano surname entries

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

@Carl Francis If possible, use the {{surname}} template when adding entries to Cebuano surnames, rather than adding "a surname" and adding the category Category:Cebuano surnames. Also, please add the etymology and language of origin (in the {{surname}} template) when known. TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 04:50, 9 September 2017 (UTC)Reply

"de", "dela/de la", "delas/de las", "del" and "delos/de los" in surnames

Latest comment: 7 years ago2 comments1 person in discussion

Please take note that the particles "de", "dela/de la", "delas/de las", "del" and "delos/de los" from Spanish surnames used in Cebuano should be always in lowercase, so the Cebuano entry for "dela Cruz" is not "Dela Cruz". I am redirecting the surnames with those uppercase articles to the one with the lowercase particles. TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 11:23, 13 October 2017 (UTC)Reply

Also, please note that capitalization of "dela/de la", "delas/de las", "del" and "delos/de los" in surnames are only capitalized in indexing, but those are always in lowercase. TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 11:26, 13 October 2017 (UTC)Reply

Language separator

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hi. When you add a new language section (e.g. katmon), remember to add the "----" line. Otherwise we are going to confuse a lot of bots. Thanks! Equinox ◑ 02:15, 16 October 2017 (UTC)Reply

Surname entries: please use the {{surname}} template

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

@Carl Francis Again, please use the {{surname}} template on surname entries you create. Being non-English is not a reason not to use that, and the template will remove the need for you to add the category manually. You did use the {{surname}} template on surname entries you created at first, but you soon resorted on adding it yourself, manually. TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 10:47, 2 November 2017 (UTC)Reply

temp:etyl

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hello. Might I ask you to stop using {{etyl}}? We're phasing it out and replacing it with {{der}} (and {{inh}} / {{bor}} when appropriate). Thank you! --Barytonesis (talk) 10:40, 3 November 2017 (UTC)Reply

Cebuano word dagan

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

May I know why my edits got reverted? --Josefwintzent Libot (talk) 04:59, 13 November 2017 (UTC)Reply

Edit war on the Dela Cruz entry for Cebuano

Latest comment: 7 years ago3 comments2 people in discussion

@Carl Francis:. Please give me a reason why not to change the definition of the surname Dela Cruz into a template-based one (using the {{surname}} template), that eliminates the need to add the definition and category yourself. And why would you call me a vandal, and that is all an ad hominem attack? I do not want this editing conflict to worsen, so please, stop reverting my constructive edits and insist on creating surname entries in Cebuano using a manually written definition and category. Thanks.-TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 06:55, 21 November 2017 (UTC)Reply

@Carl Francis Please reply.-TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 05:54, 22 November 2017 (UTC)Reply
  • Hi, Carl. I'm an admin, and I'd like to second TagaSanPedroAko's request that you use standard templates like {{surname}} in your entries. There is no reason not to do so in your entries, and correct formatting makes it more possible to improve our dictionary. If you do not listen, there are potential consequences, but you have been a prolific contributor and I would really like to avoid doing anything that hinders your contributions. Please follow these formatting tips, and if you have any questions, feel free to ask me. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 17:59, 28 November 2017 (UTC)Reply

English entries

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Remember to use en-noun and not ceb-noun! Equinox ◑ 14:31, 4 December 2017 (UTC)Reply

Cebuano surnames in Tagalog

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Please do not remove native Cebuano surname entries where they occur also in the Tagalog-speaking areas. Please consider that those surnames will be present elsewhere even where Cebuano is not the native language. I have to undo those for the reasons they also occur in the Katagalugan, especially Metro Manila and CALABARZON, particularly Batangas. Thanks. TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 02:21, 26 December 2017 (UTC)Reply

withtext=1

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

This parameter isn't supposed to be used, so can you please not? Also, I noticed that you wrote the definition of opsiyon as "an option". There is no need for the article here, just "option" is preferable. —Rua (mew) 20:31, 31 December 2017 (UTC)Reply

A reminder

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hello. A quick reminder: please don't use {{etyl}}, it's deprecated. Use {{der}} instead. Thanks. --Per utramque cavernam (talk) 18:28, 8 January 2018 (UTC)Reply

cachila

Latest comment: 7 years ago7 comments3 people in discussion

You say it is Spanish, but put in it Cebuano categories eg. "head|ceb|adjective". I'm confused. SemperBlotto (talk) 07:21, 13 January 2018 (UTC)Reply

@Semper, this entry looks very off-base.
@Carl, where did you get any of this? As best I can ascertain, cachila is indeed a word in Spanish, but it certainly doesn't mean Spanish in the Spanish language. See the entry in the official Diccionario de la lengua española published by the Real Academia Española. The given senses are:
  • Arg. y Ur. Pájaro pequeño, de color pardo con vetas oscuras y garganta y vientre amarillento, de hábitos terrestres, y que realiza vuelos acrobáticos en época de apareamiento.
Argentina and Uruguay. Small bird, of brown color with dark streaks and yellowish throat and belly, of terrestrial habits, and that performs acrobatic flights in time of mating.
  • Ur. Automóvil antiguo.
Uruguay. Antique automobile.
  • Ur. Automóvil viejo y deteriorado por el uso.
Uruguay. Automobile that is old and worn out from use.
The Spanish word for Spanish is español (masculine) or española (feminine).
HTH, ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 09:28, 14 January 2018 (UTC)Reply
Oxford Dictionaries has it as an informal noun meaning something like veteran car. SemperBlotto (talk)#
By way of additional reference, it seems there is a Cebuano term katsila that means Spanish -- http://www.binisaya.com/node/21?search=binisaya&word=cachila&Search=Search ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 10:11, 14 January 2018 (UTC)Reply
And per that Oxford link:
  • Uruguay informal Automóvil antiguo, especialmente el de las primeras décadas del siglo XX.
Uruguay, informal: Antique automobile, especially one from the first decades of the 20th century.
This seems in line with the Academia entry above.
‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 10:13, 14 January 2018 (UTC)Reply
It is Spanish and only appears in the Spanish spoken in colonial Cebu Carl Francis (talk) 10:17, 14 January 2018 (UTC)Reply
I found a book that lays out a different derivation, La lengua española en Filipinas by Antonio Quilis and Celia Casado Fresnillo, published 2008. Relevant text (bolding below is mine, link here):

3.2.3 Metátesis

Son my poco raros los casos de metátesis. Además de los que acabamos de ver, como recurso para formar grupos tautosilábicos (grabansos, klabera) or heterosilábicos (kompormiso, purbado, porpina, madrasta, padrasto), debemos mencionar en tagalo: eksena “escena”, argabyado “agraviado”; y en cebuano: katsila (< esp. “castilla”) ‘español’, como nombre, y katsilaón o katsilán ‘español’, como adjetivo, pader ‘pared’.

Cases of metathesis are very rare. In addition to those we just saw, as a resource for forming tautosyllabic (grabansos , klabera ) or heterosyllabic groups (kompormiso , purbado , porpina , madrasta , padrasto ), we must mention in Tagalog: eksena “escena”, argabyado “agraviado”; and in Cebuano: katsila (from Spanish castilla) ‘Spanish’, as a noun, and katsilaón or katsilán ‘Spanish’, as an adjective, pader ‘pared (“wall”)’.

This makes the case that Cebuano katsila is from Spanish castilla. Given also the semantics, the term cachila must derive from the Cebuano, and not from any Spanish source.
@Carl, @Semper, are either of you familiar with the formatting conventions for Spanish entries? I'm not. Just as a user, I'd suggest the following:
  • Add an Etymology section clarifying the source of this term.
  • Add labels that more clearly identify this as Cebuano Spanish.
  • Add usage notes clarifying how this term is used -- for instance, does Cebuano Spanish also include any term español? If so, when would a Cebuano Spanish speaker use cachila, and when would they use español?
HTH, ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │Tala við mig 11:14, 14 January 2018 (UTC)Reply
No one speaks Spanish in Cebu these days. Not Cebuano since we don't use ch, ch came from Spanish. The Cebuano word is Katsila, ch -> ts. At present most still pronounce it with the ch sound. Kastila is fairly recent, and influenced by Filipino. Espanyol is almost never used except in media. Grabansos, klabera—LOL, these aren't even Cebuano. If not Spanish, probably Bisaya—that language the Spaniards made up, basically collected every word in the Visayan languages in to one. So, delete. Carl Francis (talk) 12:49, 14 January 2018 (UTC)Reply

Personal attacks

Latest comment: 7 years ago3 comments2 people in discussion

Please avoid adding personal attacks on the revert comment, like you did at the Agaton entry. While it exist also in Tagalog (as both name and surname), you seem to never agree with it, f. If you don't agree with what I am contributing, please discuss it on the talk page of the entry, before taking action. I am not a vandal, and I have been a busy editor in regard to Tagalog names and surnames, in addition to the Tagalog vocabulary. TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 07:51, 19 January 2018 (UTC)Reply

TagaSanPedroAko, It's not a personal attack, check revision history. You basically defaced the Cebuano entry and it's not the first time you did it. Plus, you don't follow formatting, you clutter up the entries you edit. Read WT:MOS on your free time. Carl Francis (talk) 07:56, 19 January 2018 (UTC)Reply
I don't find my formatting defacing, and I am using always correct formatting, yet I get in some mistakes. But, for what I know, those do not fall under vandalism (that's why I perceived the recent to be an attack on my sid3). I will say that is more of a format mistake. -TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 08:03, 19 January 2018 (UTC)Reply

bantol

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Are you sure about it being a camouflage grouper and of Scorpaenopsis oxycephala? Both ] and WP have the camouflage grouper being a different species. DCDuring (talk) 15:56, 25 January 2018 (UTC)Reply

Names

Latest comment: 7 years ago3 comments2 people in discussion

Thank you for your contributions on Cebuano names. Given name and surname definitions are non-gloss definitions, defining what a term is, as opposed to what they mean. To separate them from translations, they are spelled in italics, they begin with an upper case letter and end in a period. If you remove the upper case and the period from templates, as in

  1. a surname

someone might think: "Is this the Cebuano word meaning surname?". Also by using the given name template for diminutives will add the name in several categories, and save time.--Makaokalani (talk) 17:34, 27 February 2018 (UTC)Reply

Makaokalani The a surname you're talking about are entries that I created way before that I just don't have thd time to edit--yet. Also aren't non-English entries supposed to not end in a dot and not start with an initial capital letter? Cause I was using those in the beginning and people keep changing my edits, now I no longer use the dot and initial cap and now you're changing them.
It's no big deal, but surname and given name definitions start with a capital letter and end in a dot in every language. Translations don't. You may check, say, Chinese 丁: six translations and one surname definition; or check any random example in big surname categories. The wiktionary rules are complicated, and they keep changing...everybody makes small mistakes. I'm not asking you to fix your old edits, but why not use the templates correctly from now on? --Makaokalani (talk) 13:17, 28 February 2018 (UTC)Reply
I agree. That is standard, and that's why the {{surname}} is created, so you don't need to type the non-gloss definition and the category, manually. So, that why I and Makaokalani is fixing many you've created, but, you insist on reverting them, and even linking WT:VANDAL in the edit summary (instead of addressing what you think is wrong with us). I know you may have no time using those important templates, but why revert our fixes? We are just following agreed editing standards, and nothing else.-TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 23:28, 28 February 2018 (UTC)Reply

Answering issues you point about my surname edits

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

The verifiability issue about the surname Lomocso (that you point out to be non-existent, because the correct form is "Lumocso") has not been resolved, but, please remember that I just saw that surname elsewhere (i.e. in the news), and it is better finding an attestation elsewhere by yourself (especially through the Quiet Quentin gadget, if you have activated it). And being just associated or "native" in Cebuano does not mean it can get a foreign-language entry. Like how many foreign language surnames (including those of us Filipinos) have became English surnames (with many bring romanized forms or anglicized) because of migration, there is no reason for a surname of a Cebuano speaker (e.g. Cabahug, Bayot, Dagohoy, etc.) to become Tagalog also, with Cebuano-speaking people with such surnames have been also in Tagalog-speaking areas, so, does vice versa (Tagalog surnames can exist in Cebuano).

Regarding the Lomocso verification issue, I know that it exists along with what you suppose to be the correct form, Lumocso. I know, my etymology for it is just an assumption (I'll change it to be Cebuano in origin rather than Tagalog).

And regarding my use of the Forebears surname statistics database, that is not an issue. I use it as a resource for surname statistics, though I limited it now to the appendices I am maintaining.

Regarding what you point with Licuanan, that is not a complete made-up creation I made without attesting use of it personally. Plus, that surname is verifiable to be Chinese in origin per one source I saw, but if you think it is from the Cebuano language also, why not add it?

The issue you are pointing with Alterado is that it is from Spain (due to Spanish etymology), but it is rather from the Spanish language (it is from the 1849 surname catalog, the Catálogo alfabético de apellidos), so, do not jump to conclusions that Spanish-origin surname originally existed in Spain (or even Latin America). Several Filipino surnames of Spanish origin (e.g. Academia, Alterado, Añonuevo Atendido, Cometa, Librada) are entirely created from other Spanish words not usually used as surnames, for the purpose of those catalogs, and if there are any in Spanish-speaking countries, they can be considered foreign.-TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 00:13, 1 March 2018 (UTC)Reply

Banawon and Banhaon: Visayan origin?

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

I created entries of these surnames (Banawon and Banhaon) in Tagalog that are apparently of Visayan origin (the ending -on/-won in such surnames are one likely indicator), but I'm not certain that they are. Can you help add their origin if you know? TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 23:39, 13 March 2018 (UTC)Reply

"-anan" or "-an" and "-an"

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

As I researched online (in Binisaya.com's Cebuano Dictionary and Thesaurus, and on Mr. John U. Wolff's "A Dictionary of Cebuano Visayan"), I found out that there is a suffix "-anan" (therefore, separate but analogous to "-an"). I will change them to "-anan" assuming that you agree ;) (Search through words suffixed with "-anan" like tulganan , labhanan and kan-anan in Binisaya.com's Dictionary).--JamesVTorregosa (talk) 13:46, 22 March 2018 (UTC)Reply

@JamesVin2orregosa LAWL! Good sources you got there. A dictionary that has been shunned by Cebuano speakers and an unreliable online dictionary fraught with errors and made up definitions.

Which is correct?

Latest comment: 7 years ago2 comments1 person in discussion

I am about to create these entries (napulog usa, napulog duha) but I'm not sure if I've got the correct spelling though... Is it with a hyphen or something else like an apostrophe?
I know that you know it :) --JamesVTorregosa (talk) 12:17, 23 March 2018 (UTC) Good Day!Reply

@JamesVin2orregosa napulog usa without the hyphen. binisaya.com's hyphenated entry is wrong. No need for a hyphen, the word already has a g from ug.
On the one hand, I hope that someone would have corrected it before people could see and spread the incorrect like wildfire (especially now that we have the internet).
On the other hand, I thank you for your response --JamesVTorregosa (talk) 01:37, 24 March 2018 (UTC)Reply

My surname etymologies: Please

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Can you please stop that belligerent behavior regarding my surname etymology additions? I'm really adding an etymology you don't know, but you keep on insisting that I . My edit on the Ocaña entry is not outright vandalism, just constructive editing, and you better track the obvious vandals in Cebuano entries you maintain. I have a simple mistake on my addition, so that is not a good reason to report me as a vandal. TagaSanPedroAko (talk) 22:40, 26 April 2018 (UTC)Reply

Guy and Pip

Latest comment: 7 years ago2 comments1 person in discussion

Hi. Are the two people known individually as Guy and Pip, i.e. "this is Guy, and that is Pip"? If so, the entry would be a sum of parts. Equinox ◑ 00:01, 16 June 2018 (UTC)Reply

Hi! Equinox ◑ 03:20, 21 June 2018 (UTC)Reply

tugong

Latest comment: 7 years ago3 comments1 person in discussion

I think you have the wrong species. Shouldn't it be Gnaphalium affine, w:Gnaphalium affine? The one in the entry is a New World species. G. affine is southeast Asian. DCDuring (talk) 16:00, 7 July 2018 (UTC)Reply

@DCDuring Book says Laphangium luteoalbum specifically. This one here mentions Benguet—place where the source language is spoken.
Glad I wasn't BOLD. DCDuring (talk) 16:34, 7 July 2018 (UTC)Reply
There are a large number of taxonomic synonyms. The genera seem closely related, all in tribe Gnaphalieae. DCDuring (talk) 16:39, 7 July 2018 (UTC)Reply

Names

Latest comment: 6 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

I was just wondering why you add Cebuano to names like 'Michael' and 'Jennifer' where Cebuano is not a etymologically significant influence on these names, nor have they really evolved from their original spelling in their common usage. You just copy and paste the English definition under a Cebuano header, what is the purpose in doing so?

Cadmean fixen (talk) 00:21, 31 July 2018 (UTC)Reply

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